What is ownership? If I say you own a car, but take it and drive it whenever I want, even if you may own it- I control it. Given that context, is modern Russia socialist or capitalist?
Modern Russia is capitalist, I don’t think anyone thinks it’s socialist anymore. The USSR dissolved over 3 decades ago. Ownership of property is protected by the state, be it public ownership or private ownership. Trying to abstract an analogy doesn’t actually work the same way at a societal level.
You said larger firms and key industries. In Russia small firms are more private, but larger firms and industries range from heavily state influenced to fully nationalized.
Russia has a larger portion of state-owned industry as a holdover from the soviet era as compared to most capitalist countries, but they aren’t socialist and are dominated by capitalists. They do not have a working class state any longer.
But it does not meet the definition of capitalism you gave. I agree its also not entirely socialist. It’s almost like its not a binary, most economies are mixed. The US is also not purely capitalist.
Capitalism and socialism are determined by what’s principle. All economies have elements of private and public property, what matters is which is principle, and which class is in control. The US is capitalist, “purity” has nothing to do with that.
Except that is not the principle in either country. There are plenty of cases where the state is in principle in control, or actually in control. Russia, similar to other economies, such as fascist Italy or China is structured in such away where you can exist as a “private” company as long as you ultimately bow to the state. You could also put many of the gulf states into that club. If socialism is not “when government does stuff” then capitalism is not “when rich people”
In China, the large firms and key industries are overwhelmingly publicly owned and planned, and the working class is in control of the state. I never once said capitalism is “when rich people” or that socialism is “when the government does stuff.”
What is ownership? If I say you own a car, but take it and drive it whenever I want, even if you may own it- I control it. Given that context, is modern Russia socialist or capitalist?
Modern Russia is capitalist, I don’t think anyone thinks it’s socialist anymore. The USSR dissolved over 3 decades ago. Ownership of property is protected by the state, be it public ownership or private ownership. Trying to abstract an analogy doesn’t actually work the same way at a societal level.
You said larger firms and key industries. In Russia small firms are more private, but larger firms and industries range from heavily state influenced to fully nationalized.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_companies_of_Russia
4/5 the top 5 companies are transparently state owned
Russia has a larger portion of state-owned industry as a holdover from the soviet era as compared to most capitalist countries, but they aren’t socialist and are dominated by capitalists. They do not have a working class state any longer.
But it does not meet the definition of capitalism you gave. I agree its also not entirely socialist. It’s almost like its not a binary, most economies are mixed. The US is also not purely capitalist.
Capitalism and socialism are determined by what’s principle. All economies have elements of private and public property, what matters is which is principle, and which class is in control. The US is capitalist, “purity” has nothing to do with that.
Except that is not the principle in either country. There are plenty of cases where the state is in principle in control, or actually in control. Russia, similar to other economies, such as fascist Italy or China is structured in such away where you can exist as a “private” company as long as you ultimately bow to the state. You could also put many of the gulf states into that club. If socialism is not “when government does stuff” then capitalism is not “when rich people”
In China, the large firms and key industries are overwhelmingly publicly owned and planned, and the working class is in control of the state. I never once said capitalism is “when rich people” or that socialism is “when the government does stuff.”
To not too dissimilar an extent as modern Russia
Do you believe this for North Korea? If so, why not Russia?